SACRAMENTO, Calif. — Gov. Gavin Newsom’s new podcast has everyone in politics abuzz, from supporters who were shocked by his remarks on transgender athletes to foes who have seized upon his apparent heel turn as a calculated move to appeal to moderates and distance himself from his liberal brand.

That may be just what the media-savvy governor is looking for as he mulls over a run for president in 2028. He’ll need to appeal to a base beyond his native California and reach potential voters as trust in institutions like legacy media and government remain low. He famously eschews written notes and prefers to rely on his memory and intellect to spar with ideological opponents and deliver speeches, making a long-form podcast an ideal platform for the dyslexic politician.

But political communication experts are skeptical that Newsom will attract a devoted following to rival that of conservatives, who have largely dominated the podcast market, or attract undecided voters in swing states like Michigan and Pennsylvania. Liberals and conservatives reported having negative thoughts when asked about his podcast, according to a recent California poll.

“I’m not sure podcasts are the best way to reach people who are less interested in politics,” said Tobe Berkovitz, a Boston University professor. He likened them to partisan networks like MSNBC and Fox News. “With podcasts you’re going to be, in general, preaching to the converted.”

Nor is Newsom’s name recognition enough to sustain an audience, Berkovitz said. “He has good name recognition, but do I want to spend my time and maybe, in the future, money listening to this guy? Those are two different questions.”

The governor doesn’t earn any money via either of his podcasts, according to financial disclosures, and Charlie Kirk, the only out-of-state guest he’s hosted so far, paid his own way to Newsom’s Marin County home for the event. In addition to Kirk, Newsom has hosted shock jock Michael Savage and Donald Trump strategist Steve Bannon. He also interviewed Minnesota Democratic Gov. Tim Walz last weekend, according to spokesperson Anthony York.

Megan Duncan, an associate communications professor at Virginia Tech, said podcasts represent a new forum where politicians can reach voters, much as Barack Obama was the first candidate to utilize social media in the 2008 election.

The 2024 election “represented the legitimization of podcasting as something that nominees need to consider part of their routine campaign now,” Duncan said.

A podcast pitfall

With that strategy though, she said, comes another potential pitfall.

“As soon as someone decides to run for national office or get a Senate confirmation for a Cabinet position, people run to past remarks to scrutinize, to look for something that could be held against them,” Duncan said. “To be talking in a podcast atmosphere that’s a little more casual, more off the cuff, that’s going to add reams of documents for any of those folks who are looking for statements that they can hold up and say, ‘This is why you’re unqualified.’”

Newsom’s remarks to Kirk about how “deeply unfair” it was for trans athletes to compete with cisgender competitors upset supporters and forced into the open an ongoing conflict with the California Legislature’s LGBTQ Caucus after two of his top officials tried to discourage members from sending trans-related legislation to his desk for approval while he courted Trump for wildfire aid.

Responses to the podcast have been largely incredulous, according to a 1,000-person poll of California voters conducted by political data scientist Paul Mitchell. Most Republicans, while generally agreeing with his statements on trans athletes, said he was “fake,” a “liar,” and “pandering” to rebrand himself as a moderate. Liberals responded by reporting a 16-point drop in favorability toward Newsom, from 46% to 30%.

Former Republican Rep. Adam Kinzinger and Kentucky Democratic Gov. Andy Breshear criticized Newsom for hosting Bannon, who served four months in prison for defying a congressional subpoena related to the Jan. 6 Capitol attack.

“I am in shock at the stupidity of Gavin Newsom inviting Bannon on his podcast,” Kinzinger said in a social media post. “Many of us on the right sacrificed careers to fight Bannon, and Newsom is trying to make a career and a presidential run by building him up. Unforgivable and insane.”

Sister Souljah moment

“I’m not sure what his strategy is,” one political consultant said. “Other than we’re continuing to talk about Gavin Newsom.” Another consultant called it Newsom’s “Sister Souljah moment on steroids,” referring to when former President Bill Clinton repudiated the Bronx rapper’s anti-police statements.

“It’s a political tactic,” the second consultant said. “Newsom is picking a fight with the far left, or really the center-left, of his party to show he’s not beholden to them.”

Newsom defended himself in an email to supporters, saying he was creating a new avenue to push back on Trumpism.

“First, I think it’s critically important for us to understand how the MAGA-right organized itself during the last election and what they are thinking about in the weeks, months and years ahead,” he wrote. “And finally, I think we all agreed after the last election that it’s important for Democrats to explore new and unique ways of talking to people. And by all accounts, these conversations are reaching lots of people.”

Since its debut last month, clips of “This Is Gavin Newsom” have racked up millions of views on YouTube and TikTok, far more than “Politickin’,” the show he co-hosts with football champion Marshawn Lynch and sports agent Doug Hendrickson. As of Monday, “This Is Gavin Newsom” was Apple’s ninth most popular show in the United States.

iHeart Media, which produces both of Newsom’s podcasts, did not respond to a question about how many listeners tuned into the new show.

In a Fox News op-ed, Kirk warned the GOP against underestimating the governor, whom he called one of the country’s most “ambitious” politicians with “a shark’s instincts” for anticipating changes in public opinion.

Indeed, four days after his March 6 episode with Kirk, 60% of Democrats polled by Echelon Insights said they agreed with Newsom on trans athletes. In the same poll, Newsom trailed behind Pete Buttigieg and Kamala Harris and tied with Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez when respondents listed who they would support in a 2028 primary.

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